linuxmafia.com 2016/linuxmafia.com.tar/linuxmafia.com/bas/correspondence

INI File | 2004-10-15 | 33KB | 942 lines

[E-mails from me to Patrick, illustrating the basic problems: (1)
persistent technological cluelessness, (2) refusing to listen to
corrections on verifiable matters of fact, (3) failure to comprehend
that my Web/ftp hosting business does not exist for his benefit, and
is not under his direction, (4) belligerence to the point of deleting
unread my replies to his queries, (5) maneouvering to prevent the BAS
Board of Directors hearing my viewpoint, and (6) willfully violating
my copyright.]






From rick Sun Sep  6 02:03:20 1998
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 6 Sep 1998 02:03:20 -0700
From: Rick Moen <rick>
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Upcoming BAS meetings are now on my Web page
References: <[e-mail]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
X-Mailer: Mutt 0.91.2
In-Reply-To: <[e-mail]>; from [e-mail] on Wed, Sep 02, 1998 at 09:58:34AM -0400
Status: RO
Content-Length: 1266
Lines: 31

Quoting [e-mail] ([e-mail]):

> Hi Rick, If you get some free time today, will you please update
> the upcoming events section of the Web Page?

Hi!  It took me a while, but I got it done -- and wrote personally
to the several people who had inquired about upcoming BAS events.

The need to rebuild my main machine -- and make changes to keep
the system-cracker from breaking back in again -- put a crimp
in my style, for a good bit.  Among the things that the rebuild
broke was my e-mail program -- and it's been this long before I
got it really (properly) usable.

You got the "SETI at Home" URL wrong in your earlier e-mail to me.
Should be:  "http://setiathome.ssl.berkeley.edu/"

The interesting part is the nature of your error:  You wrote
"ssi" instead of "ssl":  Undoubtedly, you transcribed this from
something written down.  It's easy to make errors doing so, and
the way to avoid it is to cut-and-paste from an electronic
document, instead.

Don't be a stranger:  Give me a page, some time, if you'd like to
chat and say hello (or if you might have time to stop by):
[pager number omitted]

--
Cheers,
Rick Moen                      "vi is my shepherd; I shall not font."
rick (at) hugin.imat.com                          -- Psalm 0.1 beta






From rick Sun Sep  6 10:30:10 1998
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 6 Sep 1998 10:30:10 -0700
From: Rick Moen <rick>
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: great updates!
References: <[e-mail]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
X-Mailer: Mutt 0.91.2
In-Reply-To: <[e-mail]>; from [e-mail] on Sun, Sep 06, 1998 at 01:26:19PM -0400
Status: RO
Content-Length: 267
Lines: 10

Quoting [e-mail] ([e-mail]):

> Hi RIck, The former Heaven's Gate member is Todd Berger.

Fixed.  Thanks!

--
Cheers,
Rick Moen                      "vi is my shepherd; I shall not font."
rick (at) hugin.imat.com                          -- Psalm 0.1 beta





From [e-mail] Sun Sep  6 10:34:58 1998
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 6 Sep 1998 10:34:58 -0700
From: Rick Moen <[e-mail]>
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: BAS Events -- Late August/Early September?
References: <[e-mail]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
X-Mailer: Mutt 0.91.2
In-Reply-To: <[e-mail]>; from [e-mail] on Sun, Sep 06, 1998 at 01:22:03PM -0400
Status: RO
Content-Length: 824
Lines: 23

Quoting [e-mail] ([e-mail]):

> Hi Rick, That is wonderful! Thanks alot. It looks great. Michael Shermer has
> agreed to be our speaker for April.  We will have to pay his airfare. (Perhaps
> a few of us can chip in on that one.

When the time comes, if I can find out what his flight is, I can take
care of his transportation to and from the airport.  (He'd be better off
using Oakland International, but I can do either one.  Dad was an
airline pilot, so I know all about our local airports.)

By the way, just to be obnoxious, here's a poem of my own composition:

Alot
Isnot
Aword.

<grin>

--
Cheers,                                  DISCLAIMER:  I didn't do it.
Rick Moen                                You can't prove it.  Nobody
rick (at) hugin.imat.com                 saw me.  The sheep are lying.





From [e-mail] Sun Sep  6 10:43:19 1998
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Sun, 6 Sep 1998 10:43:19 -0700
From: Rick Moen <[e-mail]>
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Upcoming BAS meetings are now on the Web page
References: <[e-mail]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
X-Mailer: Mutt 0.91.2
In-Reply-To: <[e-mail]>; from [e-mail] on Sun, Sep 06, 1998 at 01:24:19PM -0400
Status: RO
Content-Length: 854
Lines: 19

Quoting [e-mail] ([e-mail]):

> HI RIck, I got the setihome address from the SF Chronicle. Your suggestion is
> a good one about getting it directly from the internet, which I will
> henceforth do. I have looked at their Web Page and it would have been easy
> enough to have done it that way. At heart, I am still a print guy.

Just so you know, the SF Comical gets wrong statements about the Internet
far more regularly than it gets them right.  I'm fond of the old grey
lady (the Chron), but it's of marginal competence.

For decent technology coverage, the SJ Mercury-News is your only option.
'Course, to put it in perspective, the Murky-News has the best such
coverage in the _country_.

--
Cheers,
Rick Moen                      "vi is my shepherd; I shall not font."
rick (at) hugin.imat.com                          -- Psalm 0.1 beta





From [e-mail] Mon Sep  7 23:18:08 1998
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 7 Sep 1998 23:18:08 -0700
From: Rick Moen <[e-mail]>
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Upcoming BAS meetings are now on the Web page
References: <[e-mail]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
X-Mailer: Mutt 0.91.2
In-Reply-To: <[e-mail]>; from [e-mail] on Sun, Sep 06, 1998 at 04:26:42PM -0400
Status: RO
Content-Length: 754
Lines: 20

I hope you _do_ realise that I was just teasing you about "alot".

Quoting [e-mail] ([e-mail]):

> I agree wholeheartedly with you that the December affair should be at a
> restaurant. I have some  ideas about the dinner that I will briefly discuss at
> the next Board Meeting (later this month).  Briefly, though, I think BAS
> should have an awards ceremony at the December affair.

Awfully good idea.  If we'd like to give out some plaques, I'll be
willing to foot the bill.

>  On the Web Page, Bob is still listed as a Board Member but he resigned....

Fixed.  Thanks for mentioning it.

--
Cheers,
Rick Moen                      "vi is my shepherd; I shall not font."
rick (at) hugin.imat.com                          -- Psalm 0.1 beta








[The "Bob" referred to, above, is one of the six founders, whom Patrick
attacked in group correspondence to the point where he quit the Board of
Directors, instead of enduring more abuse.]







From rick Tue Sep  8 15:11:17 1998
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1998 15:11:17 -0700
From: Rick Moen <rick>
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Michael Shermer
References: <[e-mail]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
X-Mailer: Mutt 0.91.2
In-Reply-To: <[e-mail]>; from [e-mail] on Tue, Sep 08, 1998 at 04:39:05PM -0400
Status: RO
Content-Length: 1347
Lines: 35

Quoting [e-mail] ([e-mail]):

> hi Rick, If possible, it would be great to list Michael Shermer's local
> appearances on the BAS Web Page (mentioning, of course, his upcoming BAS
> lecture). Sincerely, Patrick

Done.  To recap:

-- Th. 8 Sept, 7:30-9:00 pm, Kepler's:  ADDED
-- Su. 13 Sept, 5:00 pm, Spring Hill Books:  ADDED
-- Nov. 12-13, interviews:  NOT ADDED - INSUFFICIENT DATA
-- Jan., BAS lecture:  ALREADY LISTED, WAITING FOR MORE DETAIL

If I'm missing anything, please let me know.


What's the plan for Saturday dinner?  I'm occupied in S.F. from
4 pm to about 6 pm, Saturday, and free thereafter.


By the way, I realise that Shermer sent _you_ one of those obnoxious
HTML e-mails, and you just "forwarded" it.  Still, in the future,
if you get someone's funky "attachment" instead of ordinary, plain-text
e-mail, please copy it to Clipboard, then paste it into a fresh
e-mail from Clipboard, rather than repeating the first author's
mistake ("attachments" and HTML format).

(I'm tired of people e-mailing me HTML gibberish, and it's very likely
that, some time soon, I'll configure my e-mail program to silently
discard all arriving e-mail that's HTML-encoded.  FYI.)

--
Cheers,
Rick Moen                      "vi is my shepherd; I shall not font."
rick (at) hugin.imat.com                          -- Psalm 0.1 beta





From rick Mon Sep 14 01:04:11 1998
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 01:04:11 -0700
From: Rick Moen <rick>
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Board Meeting
References: <[e-mail]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
X-Mailer: Mutt 0.91.2
In-Reply-To: <[e-mail]>; from [e-mail] on Sat, Sep 12, 1998 at 08:58:06PM -0400
Status: RO
Content-Length: 982
Lines: 26

Quoting [e-mail] ([e-mail]):

> Hi RIck, A version of the attached letter was mailed to you earlier this week.
> Patrick

Thanks.

The following _isn't_ criticism, just a suggestion:  Instead of
attaching word-processor documents, which the recipient may well
not be able to read, try just copying & pasting the text directly
into your e-mail using Clipboard.

To do it:  Open your document (in your word processor) by double-clicking
it.  Do a "select all" by going to Edit Menu, Select All.  Then copy
to Clipboard.  Open your e-mail program.  Now, paste from Clipboard
into the body of an e-mail.

As it happened, I have nothing that can read your word-processor
files, but I opened them in simple editing tools, anyway, and was
able to decipher the gist of your letter from amongst a great deal
of binary gibberish.

--
Cheers,
Rick Moen                      "vi is my shepherd; I shall not font."
rick (at) hugin.imat.com                          -- Psalm 0.1 beta





From rick Tue Sep 22 02:14:27 1998
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 1998 02:14:27 -0700
From: Rick Moen <rick>
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Gratuitous advice about herding cats
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
X-Mailer: Mutt 0.91.2
Status: RO
Content-Length: 3130
Lines: 62

Running Board meetings is rather like herding cats:  The personnel
are every bit as cooperative.  Still, one tries.  I have some
observations/opinions that I'd like to convey.

The Board meets in order to do the one thing it can't do without a
meeting:  Vote on motions.  Motions may arise from the agenda items
the meeting goes through.  In informal meetings, one also allows
"new business" at the agenda's end.  Important point:  The Board
officially and literally does _nothing_ except by passing or
defeating motions.  Discussions and announcements of individial
intentions are _not_ Board actions, in any way.  The Board
_cannot act_ except through such voting.  What the Secretary's
official Minutes show us as voting on _is_ the official sum-total
of the Board's deeds.  (The Minutes should show who attended,
any motions' text, whether they passed or failed, and any reports
approved by Board vote.  Nothing else.)

As meeting moderator/cat-herder, your aim is to get through the
agenda + new business efficiently.  The problem is that the cats
you're trying to herd (the Board members) will tend to digress,
start chatting, and generally forget their real purpose in attending.
This is how one gets three-hour Board meetings.

Now, here's the thing:  Nobody will actually _complain_ about
three-hour Board meetings, but they'll all go home saying "Jesus,
I sacrificed an entire evening for _that_?"  People cease coming
and drop out, because they know it wastes too much time.

The remedy?  Keep telling people that they're welcome to discuss
their tangential points after the meeting adjourns.  Keep moving
though the agenda.  When it's done, adjourn.  If people can't seem
to move something to a quick resolution, and want to debate it
endlessly, rule it deferred to next meeting, or refer it to an
individual or subcommittee to report back at the next meeting,
or designate someone to decide the matter on his own.

The outcome is then much more pleasant:  Meetings will be over
in less than an hour (mine always were), and those who have other
tasks elsewhere can then leave, but also anyone's welcome to stay
and chat.  Meetings will focus on actual business, less of which
will get lost in the shuffle.

Another benefit:  In volunteer groups, there's an unhealthy
tendency to put off decisions until everyone can get together
and talk.  This results in institutional paralysis between
meetings, and interminable discussions during meetings, because
nobody's done any discussion before the meeting.

Whereas, if you zip through the agenda, and then adjourn, people
will figure out very quickly that they'd better link up with
Board members between meetings to do discussion.  They might
learn to use their telephones and e-mail, _or_ simply take action
without waiting for group debate.  The result is much, much better
for the organisation.

The above is not just theory; it's observation.  Please consider
giving it a try.

--
Cheers,                 "Heedless of grammar, they all cried 'It's him!'"
Rick Moen                       -- R.H. Barham, _Misadventure at Margate_
[e-mail]





From [e-mail] Tue Sep 22 18:24:27 1998
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 1998 18:24:27 -0700
From: Rick Moen <[e-mail]>
To: [e-mail], Genie <[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Web Page
References: <[e-mail]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
X-Mailer: Mutt 0.91.2
In-Reply-To: <[e-mail]>; from [e-mail] on Tue, Sep 22, 1998 at 05:50:22PM -0400
Status: RO
Content-Length: 3603
Lines: 83

This is a private e-mail, which I trust (well, not really -- see below)
will not be forwarded, copied, or otherwise related to third parties:
I did not consent to this e-mailed group discussion.  I object to it,
in fact -- but, unfortunately, you (Patrick) have left me little option
but to participate in it, now that you have started it.


Quoting [e-mail] ([e-mail]):

> The items Arnold was referring to at the Board Meeting are located in the
> Wordwide Skeptic ftp Archives in the files to classify.

Yes, I gave him the exact URL in _my_ ftp tree, in _my_ "worldwide skeptic
ftp archive".  After my ftp archive had existed for some years, at your
request I created a link from my Web page that I maintain for BAS to
the ftp site as a whole.

If you wish, I will be glad to remove the link on my Web page for BAS
that points to my worldwide ftp archive.  Additionally, if you would
like me to remove any other parts of the services I provide to BAS
for free, I'll be glad to oblige.

> I do not believe that they belong on the BAS Web Page.

The document _is not_ on what you call "the BAS Web page" (meaning my
HTML that I maintain on my Web server for BAS's benefit).  I strongly
suggest that you re-check your facts.

It is equally easy to get from "the BAS Web page", through exactly
the same number of steps, to
ftp://hugin.imat.com/pub/dilbert/dilbert.correlation.factor.txt

Does you feel you should also object to the Dilbert Correlation Factor
being "on the BAS Web page"?

> Will you consider maintaining the Archives on your personal Web Page....

The question suggests that you do not understand the difference between
ftp and http.  It reflects a fundamental misunderstanding of the
situation.

There are several further things that I notice in this situation:

1.  You have elected to make a poorly-thought-out request of me
without consulting with me first.

2.  In so doing, you have cc'd Alfred and Genie on this discussion,
knowing of the unfortunate history of complete lack of confidentiality
on our Board.  I now have to face the possibility that some or all of
this private exchange will become publicly distributed.  That is some
combination of negligent and hostile on your part -- except that
the intention is of nugatory importance compared to the result.

3.  You have failed to ask me, first, _why_ I have the document
present on my ftp site.

4.  You failed to state what, if anything, about the document makes
you uncomfortable, aside from Arnold's relaying of Mr. Sabsay's
dislike of its existence, for reasons Arnold did not understand but
felt compelled to raise for Board consideration, anyhow.

(Mr. Sabsay's reason for its existence might include its revealing
the nature of his dealings with us in his own words, contradicting
the picture he likes to paint in public.)

>   Thanks.

Let me be plain about this:  I am aghast that you should make this
request, _especially_ without talking to me first, even though you have
no idea what you're talking about.  Just _once_, I would like to go
through an entire round of dealings with the BAS Board of Directors
without being asked to do things to make Sabsay, of all people, happy.
This man should not be on our agenda in any way.

I do not wish to discuss Sabsay or anything about him.  If you intend
to have a follow-up discussion, I'd suggest making it be short, _and_
I would strongly suggest cutting out the cc's -- because there is
more than one way to remove this topic from my life, and I'm very
likely to use whichever one seems most effective.

--
Sincerely,
Rick Moen





From rick Tue Sep 22 18:44:28 1998
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 1998 18:44:28 -0700
From: Rick Moen <rick>
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Bad address for Arnold
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
X-Mailer: Mutt 0.91.2
Status: RO
Content-Length: 1142
Lines: 30

You may notice that your e-mail cc to Arnold bounced because
you had his address wrong.

To my way of thinking, this is a good thing:  You should not have
started a semi-public discussion in the way you did.  (See the
points in my other e-mail.)   _If_ you elect to send Arnold a
fresh copy of your cc -- which I think is every bit as bad an
idea as your original posting -- then I ask that as a courtesy
that you also send him my reply.

To clarify:

Since I replied to your entire original cc list, my reply went
to the same bad address for Arnold as did your original cc'd post.
It therefore likewise bounced.  Therefore, I ask that you send
him (at his correct address) either both posts (yours and mine)
or neither.  I'd prefer the latter.

To reiterate:  I strongly suggest that you drop the entire
subject.  I don't want to hear about good intentions:  There's
no excuse for hitting me with more about my doing things for
(in effect) Sabsay's benefit.

I don't want to hear more about it; I'm tired of the whole subject,
and will eliminate it from my life in whatever is the most expedient
way.

--
Sincerely,
Rick Moen





From [e-mail] Tue Sep 22 18:54:53 1998
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 1998 18:54:53 -0700
From: Rick Moen <[e-mail]>
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Gratuitous advice about herding cats
References: <[e-mail]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
X-Mailer: Mutt 0.91.2
In-Reply-To: <[e-mail]>; from [e-mail] on Tue, Sep 22, 1998 at 05:17:58PM -0400
Status: RO
Content-Length: 1287
Lines: 32

Quoting [e-mail] ([e-mail]):

> The board meeting went well. Everybody now knows what needs to be
> done and most have agreed to help.

You're missing the point:  "Knowing what needs to be done and agreeing
to help" can be done outside the time-span of a Board meeting, thereby
being considerate of people's time and focussing the Board meeting
itself on business.

> I have no complaints about it at all.

Well, I do.  There was no excuse for the meeting portion of the evening
taking so long.  It was inconsiderate to everyone present to not finish
the Board business in a timely fashion, thereby allowing people to
leave if they didn't have time to stay and socialise.  75%+ of what
occurred was not Board business.  If the jokes and digressions were
deferred to after the meeting, we had _way_ less than an hour's
business.

This does not bode well for future management of meetings.  Please
consider my suggestions, since I mean them extremely seriously,
and will continue to raise them.

I made a point of raising them with you privately.  I would not
dream of putting you on the spot in front of others before doing
so.  That would be an unpleasant thing to do, even in such a
relatively minor matter.  {_Huge_ hint there, Patrick.}

--
Sincerely,
Rick Moen





From [e-mail] Wed Sep 23 00:09:01 1998
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 1998 00:09:01 -0700
From: Rick Moen <[e-mail]>
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Web Page
References: <[e-mail]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
X-Mailer: Mutt 0.91.2
In-Reply-To: <[e-mail]>; from [e-mail] on Tue, Sep 22, 1998 at 11:37:27PM -0400
Status: RO
Content-Length: 4166
Lines: 96

Quoting [e-mail] ([e-mail]):

> I am sorry you feel that way. I respect you, like you and value your skills
> and work. I do not want to think of Daniel either. Having access to the
> archives, through our Web Page, with information about him in it bothers me
> and I believe it should not be there.

It's "accessible through our Web page" (to reiterate:  _BAS_ does not
have a Web page; I contribute, gratis, a page on my Web server _for_
BAS -- and please note my copyright notice) only to the exact same
extent that the Dilbert Correlation factor article is.

I stated this before; you evidently have chosen not to believe me.
I notice that we keep having this problem:  You elect to disbelieve
what I say, _including_ when I speak in my areas of professional
expertise.

Each time previously when this has happened (your electing to think
that I did not mean literally what I said), you have later found
to your regret that I meant _exactly_ what I said.  I hope you will
see the pattern, because we appear to be headed down the same path.

> I think, too, that the majority of the Board will agree.

You could attempt to strong-arm me via the Board.  This would likely
result in my removing the annoyance from my life, through whatever
is the most efficient means.  (E.g., please see below.)

> I believe that the information in the archives should be preserved and
> having it on your personal Web Page (the one that says specifically
> "Rick Moen") will make it available. That seems like a decent
> compromise to me.

Patrick, I'm having to repeat myself, and I'm not happy about having
to do so:  _It isn't on the Web._  Do you understand that?  It's not
a frigging HTML document.  It's part of my ftp site.

If your idea of "a decent compromise" is telling me how to run my
Internet server business, then you are badly and egregiously mistaken.
You are suffering a disconnect with reality.

>  You and I have been through this before and I do not want e-mail
> dialog over it.

Then you would seem to be acting against your interests, since I
already suggested strongly that you quit while you were behind.

> I would hate to lose you, as a friend whom I respect, and as a
> valued BAS Board Member.

Oh, no.  It's unlikely that I would simply evaporate.  I would
simply restructure the situation so as to eliminate the annoyance.
For example, I might eliminate all direct links from my Web page
for BAS to my ftp site.  A more extensive remedy might be to
turn the skeptics' pages on my Web server into independent pages,
eliminating mention of Bay Area Skeptics.  (I would of course
require that BAS not copy the pages elsewhere, as that would violate
my copyright notice.)

The nature of the remedy I take, if any, might logically depend on
the extent and nature of the annoyance you intend to continue
intruding into my life.

> My suggestion was reasonable and respects the feelings of the
> people on the Board who are bothered by that stuff and it respects
> you and it respects the value of the archives.....

This is not a reasonable assessment, since you show unmistakeable
signs of not understanding the essential facts.  Your continuing
to assert that the document is "linked to from the Web site" is
one of several instances of this, as well as your failing to
understand the difference between http and ftp.

I'm sorry that you do not regard yourself as a technological
person, but this is a technological matter that you have fundamentally
and stubbornly misrepresented -- and you have, as usual, refused
to believe that I meant every word of my explanation to the
contrary, quite literally.

>  I am going to delete the remainder of your messages without reading
>  them.

That would be foolish, since they contained information you needed,
that I am not about to re-type.

> If you are going to resign, tell Arnold or someone else on the Board
> about me, not me.

I would be far more likely to remain and assert my vote to suit my
preferences -- which it appears may be increasingly likely to be
at odds with yours.

You claimed to value my cooperation.  You are not acting that way.

--
Sincerely,
Rick Moen








[At this point, Patrick threatened (in an e-mail not quoted) to steal my work.
I immediately removed the entire BAS presence from my Internet hosting
business.  Then, I received the e-mail quoted below:]








From [e-mail] Wed Sep 23 11:41:46 1998
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 1998 11:41:46 -0700
From: Rick Moen <[e-mail]>
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Web Page
References: <[e-mail]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
X-Mailer: Mutt 0.91.2
In-Reply-To: <[e-mail]>; from [e-mail] on Wed, Sep 23, 1998 at 01:57:53PM -0400
Status: RO
Content-Length: 570
Lines: 18

Quoting [e-mail] ([e-mail]):

>   We are making arrangements to have the BAS Web Page moved.

If you copy my work, you violate my copyright, and I can enjoin this in
court:  I learned from the error of my friend Becky Long in allowing her
work on her Georgia Council against Health Fraud pages to be copied
without her permission, and have acted to make sure that is illegal and
can be enjoined.

And you have just damaged my trust in you, badly.

Congratulations.

--
Cheers,
Rick Moen                        YOU!  Out of the gene pool.
rick (at) hugin.imat.com





From [e-mail] Mon Sep 28 12:56:17 1998
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1998 12:56:17 -0700
From: Rick Moen <[e-mail]>
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: BAS
References: <[e-mail]>
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Quoting [e-mail] ([e-mail]):

> Rick,
>  BAS has a new Web Master and a new, different Web Page. Unless we have
> reasons to do otherwise, we will state that you left the position for
> philosophical reasons and that we appreciate your generosity and hard work.
>   Any response to this message will be sent to all Board Members.

Through doing the following...

1. Issuing peremptory orders based on fundamental errors of fact --
   on which you refused to hear the explanations, despite those
   errors being within my professional expertise, and (notably) not yours.
2. Refusing to clarify matters by telephone when I asked repeatedly
   and urgently that our discussion be taken to telephone.
3. Stating your intent to violate my long-established, posted copyright.

...you have greatly injured my trust and made my further assistance of
BAS, under your chairmanship, far less likely.

Upon becoming aware of point #3, I disabled access to the BAS Web
presence on my Internet servers.   (Probably, many Board members
are unaware that I operate commercial Internet services professionally,
and have been granting BAS extensive services, gratis, for years.)
Why?  Because what one cannot access, one also cannot illegally copy.
That is why you've had to create a "new different Web page".

If you "state" the above cover story, you will be dissembling to the
Board of Directors:  The truth of the matter is that I halted BAS's Web
presence to prevent threatened theft of intellectual property.  By you.
Accordingly, I do not concur in your characterisation.

Needless to say, my confidence in you as Chair has been greatly damaged,
and I cannot currently imagine how that might be remedied.

This is an extremely poor repayment for my decades of trusted work,
a trust that I have never failed to justify.

Please think long and carefully before asking my loyalty in the future.
I feel that you have betrayed it, without cause.

--
Sincerely,
Rick Moen








[Patrick declined to honour his promise to forward the above message to
all Board members.  Consequently, in this as in all other aspects of the
matter, the BAS Board of Directors was prevented from hearing any
viewpoint except Patrick's.  To my knowledge, they are to this day
ignorant of what he has done in their name.]






From [e-mail] Mon Sep 28 15:08:38 1998
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1998 15:08:38 -0700
From: Rick Moen <[e-mail]>
To: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: BAS
References: <[e-mail]>
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In-Reply-To: <[e-mail]>; from [e-mail] on Mon, Sep 28, 1998 at 05:26:30PM -0400
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Quoting [e-mail] ([e-mail]):

> You had ample opportunity to discuss the matter of Web Page content at
> the Board Meeting. You absolutely refused to do so and purposely misled
> the Board as to what was on the Web Page.

This claim is categorically in error.  What I stated at the Board meeting
is exactly what I have stated all along -- and is the exact truth:
There is no hyperlink from the "BAS Web page" to the described document.
There is a link to my entire ftp tree, where that document resides among
_thousands_ of other files, way down in a labyrinth of my text files.
That is what I said at the Board meeting.

> You were unwilling to compromise or in any way accommodate the wishes of
> a majority of Board members,....

To the contrary:  I specifically offered to remove the link from
http://hugin.imat.com/bas/index.html to my ftp site.  Twice.  It still
would have been possible to get to any part of my ftp tree, in the same
general sense that it's possible to get to any URL, but that was the
other factual matter on which you refused to listen.

> ignored an official Board decision....

This is false.  I specifically offered to remove the link from
http://hugin.imat.com/bas/index.html to my ftp site, thereby satisfying
your (error-based) perception that "the BAS Web site is linked to"
that document.  Twice, I made this offer.  You did not acknowledge
it, but instead reiterated your nonsensical proposal of my moving
a pure-text document from my ftp site to my "personal Web page".

> ...and ultimately threatened to file suit against Bay Area Skeptics.

This is demonstrably false, and, if you make this assertion to others,
I will consider it willful defamation.

I stated:  "If you copy my work, you violate my copyright, and I can
enjoin this in court."  At no point did I state my intention to do
so:  I was correctly describing a remedy that the law provides.
Fortunately, there was no need to resort to it.

>   You were not treated badly in this matter.

I understand that you are telling yourself so.  This is why I doubt you
will ever regain my confidence as Chair.

>  It is my hope that you resign from the Board.

You have miscalculated.  Repeatedly and severely -- and the damage
to BAS is continuing with each step you're now taking.

--
Sincerely,
Rick Moen





[When I said, above, that "there was no need to resort to it", I
referred to my removing my work from public access, which I _thought_
would prevent Patrick from copying it against my express prohibition.
Unfortunately, he seems to have subsequently found a copy, perhaps
in someone's browser cache.]