Tell Me About Dien Bien Phu & Khe Sanh

This topic was created by Raven
[Fri 21 May, 17:36 Tasmanian Standard Time]

Have been fascinated with Dien Bien Phu since reading
Bernard Fall's account of the battle. Anyone who has been
there, are there any remnants of the seige? Are any of the
fire support bases intact? How much time should be devoted
to the area? Is the area well marked? Any posted
descriptions of what we're seeing? Any info you could
provide would be appreciated. I'm in the early stages of
planning a trip to northern Vietnam. My main purpose is to
visit various areas in northern I Corps where I was
stationed during my Marine Corps tours in VN (Marble
Mountain, Hue/Phu Bai, PK17, Dong Ha, and Khe Sanh). But
also want to jump up to Hanoi and also over to DBPhu if
there is anything left to see there.
This will be my first return. Excited at the prospect.

[There are 14 posts - the latest was added on Tue 25 May, 11:48]

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  1. Khe Sahn Added by: John
    [Timestamp: Fri 21 May, 17:57 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    was quite a moving experience for me when I visited there 4
    years ago. It was a beautiful day when I was there up in the
    hills. In 1968 I was an 18 year old student in UK with not a
    care in the world, and you poor guys the same age were
    getting 1000's of shells per day lobbed at you. Felt
    sad for the guys who didn't make it home. Could you
    recommend a book that gives a good account of the siege;
    I'd like to know more. Sorry have no info on DBF; it was out
    of bounds to tourists when I visted the north but I think
    it's opened up now. The tunnels up on the DMZ were
    impressive; can't remember their name just now.
    Enjoy your trip.



  2. Dong Ha Added by: VR
    [Timestamp: Fri 21 May, 18:28 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    (Vinh Moc Tunnels, John!)
    If you do the Khe Sanh DMZ trip from Hue it is an
    exhausting though interesting day. Better to stay in Dong
    Ha, although not interesting in itself and do it as two
    half days, allowing you to really appreciate what you are
    seeing.



  3. Dong Ha Added by: VR
    [Timestamp: Fri 21 May, 18:28 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    (Vinh Moc Tunnels, John!)
    If you do the Khe Sanh DMZ trip from Hue it is an
    exhausting though interesting day. Better to stay in Dong
    Ha, although not interesting in itself and do it as two
    half days, allowing you to really appreciate what you are
    seeing.



  4. Marble Mountains and China Beach Added by: Danang-ite (christies_danang@hotmail.com)
    [Timestamp: Fri 21 May, 19:35 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    If you're travelling via Danang then you'll see a lot that
    will be familiar. The Danang International Airport is the
    former air force base, the Marine air-base at Marble
    Mountains is still largely intact and you can visit the
    actual mountains themselves where you'll see a cave that was
    used as a V-C hospital and a plaque commemorating a women's
    artillery batallion that lobbed a few rounds on the airbase!
    China Beach is still a great place for a swim and you can
    still find the old hospital but now it's a seafood factory.
    I have a restaurant in Danang and we get a lot of
    ex-servicemen coming through. They seem to really enjoy
    their return to Vietnam and I think you'll be the same.



  5. A guy that knows Added by: Dani
    [Timestamp: Fri 21 May, 19:56 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    might be Scott Wild. He has been arranging tours from US to VN for some years on a very small
    basis and I think he has explored every rock, bush and pothole there are in VN.
    Contact him at www.awildcard.com
    -------------------------------



  6. dmz Added by: britt (JSSC@topend.com.au)
    [Timestamp: Fri 21 May, 23:58 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    we stayed in hue and did the dmz tour this february, it was
    very informative.... however it was a very gruelling 15hrs
    on a minibus. i was a little dissapointed with khe sanh.
    when you finally get there it is a coffee plantation, you
    can see some bomb damage and a rough area which used to be
    the air strip, a small muesuem and some statues, i somehow
    expected to see war things still there but it is bare. i was
    impressed with our guide he had great information and for
    myself who knew not much about the war it was helpful but a
    very long day. the tunnels we saw were very good.



  7. Khe Sahn Added by: Mr Hallsworth
    [Timestamp: Sat 22 May, 1:20 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    I've nothing to add about DBPhu, but John asks for more info
    on Khe Sahn. Try Michael Herr's book Dispatches. He was a
    freelance journalist who probably got closer to the war than
    he planned. It is an amazing book, there is a whole chapter
    on Khe Sahn.



  8. Herr's book Added by: Farang
    [Timestamp: Sat 22 May, 3:19 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    I love "Dispatches," except for the impression that Herr
    gives that everyone smoked pot all the time. (Maybe he did,
    but if you were in the boonies that was a great way to get
    your ass blown away. I blew a few bowls in the base camp,
    and that's more than most combat GIs I knew even did. Most
    of them just drank warm beer.) Herr's book comes the closest
    I know of to being actually in the war. Problem is that it
    brings back memories I don't really need brought back. A VN
    buddy says the same thing. Good if you want to "feel" the
    war though. I wholeheartedly agree with Herr's comments on
    the Marines. Thank God I was an Army grunt instead. (e.g. We
    didn't ambush each other on a regular basis.) I met Sean
    Flynn and Tim Page once. Don't remember Herr, but he may
    have been with them.



  9. Not spectacular...but interesting for the interested Added by: Max
    [Timestamp: Sat 22 May, 8:27 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    Dien Bien Phu: Rather dissapointing for war tourists, since
    the area is not "made up". Still worth a visit for anyone
    interested in warfare history and especially the history of
    the Legion EtrangΦre. One to two days will be enough to
    stroll around the site and get an idea of the
    battle situation, though.



  10. If You Want More Info . . . Added by: Doug (dreese@erols.com)
    [Timestamp: Sat 22 May, 11:39 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    Raven,
    Contact me b/c and I'll give you my phone number if you'd like to hear more about the I Corps portion of your trip and a less expensive visa.
    Doug (9th Div, 1968 & MACV, 1969)
    Vietnamtourism/Washington DC



  11. Thanks for the Info! Added by: Raven
    [Timestamp: Sat 22 May, 18:08 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    Appreciate all of your responses very much. Will contact you
    later, Danang-ite, when my plans gets firmed up. I was
    surprised to hear that our Marine Aircraft Group 16 base at
    Marble Mt is still evident. All we had there in the 66-67
    time frame were essentially temp bldgs and living
    quarters except for the officers club which we was built for
    us by the CBs. It was beach living at its finest except when
    it was time to "go to work" each morning.
    There's more than one "cave" in the Marble Mt complex by
    the way. The area is honeycombed. There were many Buddhist
    icons and shrines inside these above-ground "caves."
    Many marble objects, desk nameplates, etc. were carved
    for sale by a small group of artisans working at the base of
    the Marble Mountain. And this was in the middle of the
    conflict!
    Thanks again, folks, for the excellent info. You've
    convinced me that Khe Sanh might be a waste of valuable
    time. If there's nothing left of the "old days," I wouldn't
    be interested. I would at least like to be able to
    orient myself and from what some of you said, there
    might not be anything left to orient on (everything then was
    pretty much established to protect the runway).
    Would like to hear more about Dien Bien Phu. If there isn't
    anything left at Khe Sanh, I can't imagine anything at
    all remaining at DBP unless the Vietnamese have
    restored it for tour purposes. What was there to actually
    see, Max. Bunkers? Trench lines? Flotsam and jetsam of war?



  12. Dien Bien Phu Added by: Max
    [Timestamp: Sun 23 May, 3:39 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    There┤s not much left of the former fortification. A few
    firebases and short sections of trench lines are in decaying,
    but discernable condition; the headquarters of french
    commander, colonel Christian de Castries has been re-created.
    There┤s a memorial on A1 hill (code name Eliane) and you can
    explore the valley floor to find some old french vehicles and
    heavy artillery guns still intact. The small museum
    eloquently tells the story of vietnamese determination to get
    rid of the colonial forces - means: it is mostly a propaganda
    display. Which shouldn┤t come as a surprise... Just take
    whatever report on the battle you have with you, get a map
    (they sell them in the museum) stroll around the site and
    read. There wasn┤t anything marked six years ago, but since
    the vietnamese tourism authorities try to promote the place
    as a tourist attraction, it may be so today. I never found
    out if there were any vietminh firebases rebuild on the
    surrounding hills.
    The busride from Hanoi took two days and was quite
    uncomfortable, but I felt more than rewarded with going
    through absolutely beautiful mountain landscapes. The Black
    Thai and Hmong hill tribe population of the area add to it┤s
    "wild" hinterland ambiente. So: I think it┤s an excellent and
    recommended trip, not only to visit the battlesite. An
    easierer way to go is by plane (from Hanoi).



  13. Thanks a Lot, Mx Added by: Raven
    [Timestamp: Mon 24 May, 17:14 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    I really appreciate your comprehensive rundown on DBP. No
    doubt in my military mind but that I'll be flying in. I'm
    not a 2-day busride man. Would rather spend more time at the
    destination. As for info on the ground, I think "Hell in a
    Very Small Place" is about as comprehensive an
    account as I'll need. Intend to take extracts like
    the battle maps, etc. Thanks again.



  14. DBP Added by: Roger (rjb@netvigator.com)
    [Timestamp: Tue 25 May, 11:48 Tasmanian Standard Time]

    DBP is worth a trip, and if you want you can fly in from
    Hanoi - but currently only 3 times a week which will give
    you a couple of days there. The flights are frequently
    cancelled, so you will need to reconfirm in Hanoi. The
    overland trip is long but has interesting scenery.
    I was in DBP a year ago, and can confirm most of what Max
    reports. Most of the signage is in Vietnamese, but you can
    access all the former strongpoints by foot. I was not able
    to locate any of the former Viet-Minh firebases, but it is
    possible to visit General Giap's former battlefield HQ.
    This is a 45 min (or thereabouts car/bus ride outside DBP
    town. There are a number of command bunkers there, but
    take a torch! You can also see some Black Tai villages en
    route.
    One point - as the LP guide points out DBP is now the
    provincial capital of Lai Chau province. There has been
    extensive building of administrative offices around the
    former strong points, so don't expect to see the remote
    village depicted in pre-battle photos.




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