your'e all wrong !.... the problem is not the US, but the
Cuban exile's. They are the ones lined up just waiting for
castro to die, so they can flood back with all the money
they have made in the US and clean up. With the kind of
money they have they will take over Cuba. Lets wait and see
how much compassion there will be for all the families that
have had to suffer living there all these years. They are
the ones responsible for maintaining the embargo, Not
Clinton, and largly the suffering and shortages of the
people living in Cuba. The ugly American is realy an ugly
sugar growing Cuban. Why do you think there was a
reveloution in the first place?.. to get rid of the rich,
share nothing, greedy Cuban, not american. They have more
money than God, and they are very clever people. So think
about it. who is the real enemy of the poor Cubans...I
guarantee you the first "Mc Donalds" in Havana will be owned
by a Cuban American
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There is a little truth in what you say. Sore
right-wing Cuban exiles are a good part of the problem, but
the US government wants all Latin America to be dependent on
it economically. The Cuban precedent is far too dangerous
for the US government to allow it to succeed ie. a Latin
American country which is not dependent on the US.
But yes, people like the 'Fanjuls' (I think that's their
name) are doing more than anyone to maintain the embargo and
try and ensure their return and dominance of the Cuban
economy, with scant regard for most ordinary Cubans.
Some things are just a part of human nature. There is always
someone in control: any religion has a Superior Being, any
tribe has a chief, any country has a president or king or
dictator, any family has a man or a woman in charge. It is
a utopian thinking to hope for equalty, with no exploitation
and no influencing. Influence and manupulation is at heart
of who we humans are. Even when it comes to food,
shelter and sex: when one wants to get a sex, he or she
manipulates the other, by paying for food or providing
entertainment, or dressing provocatively, etc.
I was born and lived for 27 years in two different communist
country, and believe me there was never equalty there, and
you needed a lot ot influences to get anywhere. Communist
leaders had a lot of power and ability to influence other
people's lives, and they used it every day.
U.S. is just doing what Cuba or China would be doing if they
had opportunity. The only difference is that U.S. has a
government that intended to give people as much freedom as
possible, although it does not always work.
Why Latin America is so poor and has fallen under U.S.
influence? Mainly, because of the selfishness of its many
governors, who stole from their own people for so many
years, starting with sabottaging Bolivar's attempts to
create a United Spanish America. Cuba maybe had no U.S.
influence for the past 40 years, but before the Berlin wall
came down it sure was under Russia's influence all right.
There are some things that will never change.
And many Latin American countries are just hipocritical,
like Mexico: they screems everytime their nationals get
deported from U.S., but they systematicly abuse the rights
of Central Americans who try to cross Mexico in order to get
to the U.S. They kill them, rape them, keep them in jail in
horrible conditions, you name it. And those are suppose to
be their hispanic brothers, after all.
Some of your points are well-taken Pete. I agree with you
that the strongest supporters in the U.S. of the Cuban
embargo would probably be Cuban-Americans. Many of these
including Cuban-American congressmen in Washington D.C. are
opposed to lifting the embargo, even on such items as food
and medicines.
You mention the rich Cuban exiles who will probably flood
back to Cuba after Castro dies. You failed to mention the
richest Cuban in the world. Are you aware of the article in
Forbes magazine last year which stated that Fidel Castro is
one of the 10 (TEN!) richest men in the world?
I really doubt that Fidel's death will change many of the
laws currently on the books in Cuba which control the
investments as well as the purchase of property or business
in Cuba.
There is not a total vacuum of leadership beyond the
immediate control of Fidel Castro. You have everyone from
Fidel's brother Raul who is the chosen successor, to Carlos
Lage, and to others of great power such as Foreign Minister
Roberto Robaina. Some Cubans think that Roberto rather than
Raul Castro will ultimately be number one.
Look at the situation of Roberto Robaina. He is the one who
controls all of the investments by foreign governments. He
is the one who meets with the officials, the investors, the
CEO's of huge companies.
Roberto is the one who controls the investments by such
international companies as Mitsubishi Motors, Castrol,
Unilever, Sherrit Gordon, Grupo Sol, Melia Hotels, Total,
ING Bank, Rolex, DHL, and Lloyds. All of these have
businesses in Cuba.
He has entre with political leaders and business leaders
from around the world. It is unthinkable that those people
who have such a close working/business relationship with the
Cuban leaders would be receptive to overtures from the exile
Cubans who have opposed any and all foreign investments in
Cuba.
The Cuban economy is a controlled economy. One can have a
ten million dollar checking account yet be unable to travel
to Cuba and buy a house, car, boat, satelite dish and other
property.
New Fiats are available for $35,000 at the modern shopping
mall which opened this spring across from the Melia Cohiba
Hotel. My friends in Cuba could not walk in and buy one of
the new cars even if they could pay cash.
Cuban exiles cannot return and begin buying up property and
businesses. They cannot run for office, be elected, and
determine the future of Cuba.
Everyone knows that Cuba is a communist dictatorship, but
many seem to forget that the government has multilevels of
government which extend all the way to the CDR persons or
block captains.
Permission is needed for one to be able to do almost
anything, specially to be able to buy, sell, or exchange
property. Cuban exiles returning to cuba would find it
extremely difficult to engage in any business
activity.
I would half-way agree that the first McDonald's in Cuba
will be owned by a Cuban American. I would just leave off
the last word, 'American'. There is also the possibility
that the first McDonald's could be owned by a Canadian,
Mexican, Italian, or someone from Germany, England, or
France. All of those have access that U.S. businessmen do
not have.
I find it difficult to believe people who left Cuba 30 or 40
years ago have much desire or incentive to return to Cuba
and attempt to rebuild a life, a home, or a business. Strong
opponents of Fidel would probably have been 30 or more years
old in 1959. How old would they be today?
After the death of Fidel Castro, the exile Cubans who seek
to return to la isla could face a more determined and less
hospital leader than Fidel. Raul has less charisma and
motivational skills than his brother Fidel who has always
been inspirational and a great motivator. Raul could be even
less inclined to have any amount of patience with those
seeking to return and reestablish homes, businesses, and
identities.
The biggest change one is likely to see following the death
of Fidel Castro is the manuevering and infighting resulting
from those now within the Cuban government seeking to
establish their own power base. It is highly unlikely there
would be much patience or tolerance for those in exile who
might desire to return to Cuba pick up the pieces.
Professor Smith from the University of Georgia is an
excellent source for those who might desire a better
understanding of the policies and politics of Cuba, both
past and present.
I understand that he was in charge of the U.S. Special
Interest Section in Cuba from many years and has a long
history of dealing with and studying the Cuban situation.
I'm amazed at the educated insights my letter has drawn. You
guys certainly seem to appreciate the situation. However to
think that the government of the day, after Castro, will be
able to stand the onslaut of returning Cuban money, not
necessarily the same Cuban who left. But the family, to
reclaim lost property and land, property that has been lived
in by another family for the past thirty odd years, is a bit
nieve. I personally know of a rich Cuban family in the US,
that is just itching to get back to claim the hundreds of
acres of land that they own. It had belonged to their
family for generations. Do you really think they will not
stop at anything to reclaim it? Sure, he won't be able go
into the store to buy a video player, but nothing is going
to stop them reclaiming their land. Consideration for the
families that have been living on it for the past thirty
years, is defiantly not their prime concern. Also as you
speak of the foreign investment polices that exist at the
moment. Certainly for a foreigner to do anything in Cuba is
very well controlled. An Italian businessman needs a good
friend in government in order for him to get what he wants.
But these returning exiles will not be foreigners or Cuban
peasant. They will be as, if not more, influential than
their Cuban, political opposition. Whatever, at the
returning of the exiles, Cuba will be thrown into absolute
chaos, and for sure the poor families living in the slums of
Havana will not be at the top of the help list.
Listen....Pete, if the Federal goverment is willing to give
back the land that once belong to the Native Americans at
the expense of taking it away from the people that now owe
it (see 60 minutes, sunday05/23) And this happened 200
years ago, for Pete's sake! Why can Cubans in exile claim
what was solely theirs and their predecessors and was taken
brutally and unpitifully by the Commander in chief? Answer
me!
Listen....Pete, if the Federal goverment is willing to give
back the land that once belong to the Native Americans at
the expense of taking it away from the people that now owe
it (see 60 minutes, sunday05/23) And this happened 200
years ago, for Pete's sake! Why can Cubans in exile claim
what was solely theirs and their predecessors and was taken
brutally and unpitifully by the Commander in chief? Answer
me!
Listen....Pete, if the Federal goverment is willing to give
back the land that once belong to the Native Americans at
the expense of taking it away from the people that now owe
it (see 60 minutes, sunday05/23) And this happened 200
years ago, for Pete's sake! Why can Cubans in exile claim
what was solely theirs and their predecessors and was taken
brutally and unpitifully by the Commander in chief? Answer
me!
In response to Hugos comment about Forbes rating Castro as
one of the 10 richest people in the world. I went to their
web site and did a search on "Castro". In another article
his net worth is much lower.
"Truth falls by the wayside when we look only for what
we want to find." Forbes much like the National Enquirer
is dependant on selling itself... the more sensational the
news the more copies are sold.
To assert that Castro is among the ten richest people in the
world is nothing short of ridiculous. If you believe this
you are, in a word, 'dumb'.
I don't think either Raul, Robaina or Lage will succeed
Castro. Raul and Robaina are disliked generally, even by
Castro's supporters. Recent events would seem to point to
Ricardo Alarc≤n, Head of the National Assembly, as
successor. This will probably happen in a transition to
power. Castro could even announce out of the blue that they
have been sharing power for the last year or so, something
to that effect, to lessen the chance of a negative reaction.
Alarc≤n has lots of experience and would be more acceptable
to the Americans. For many years he was Cuba's ambassador at
the UN. He is also a good speaker. You heard it here first.
Bombillo, I'm not sure if you are saying à" why can" or
"why cant" the Cubans in exile claim back their landà. In
response to your question. I think the basic difference
between the US government and the Cuban government is
conscience and conviction. The US has a lot of world opinion
against them, to be seen to do the right thing. Whereas the
Cuban regime are convinced that they did the right thingà
and who am I to disagree? Maybe it was the right thing to do
40 years ago. It's a pity for the Cuban people that Russia
let them down so badly. My personal opinion, and I'm sure
I'll get a lot of flack for it, is, That Castro, in the
beginning, was a great guy. Doing what he thought was right
for his country. Unfortunately, over the years the whole
thing has gone to pot. As usual in these situations the
people who suffer most are the poor.. And, as I keep going
back to. I don't think the returning exiles have the poor at
the top of their Christmas list.
Your original post was very thought provoking Pete. You have
elicited a lot of intelligent, sincere, and passionate
debate on an interesting topic.
-
There has been some differences of opinion, but most of the
writers have respected the other person's right to hold a
different view.
-
I have always felt that if you find two people who agree on
everything 100% of the time, then one of them is likely to
be a deaf, blind mute.
-
I have no doubt that you will get additional intelligent
responses to your post. No one seems to be posting for the
sole purpose of trading insults.
Hugo, I appreciate the compliment. thank you.... Who are
you???? and what is your interest in Cuba ?
I am British, involved with a family of six, living in the
slums of Havana. Their plight breaks my heart. I see the
kids with nothing to eat but rice... day after day ,,,just
rice.. Mum is diabetic and can't get insulin. the sister
goes on the street to get dollars. But now, even that has
been stopped. the police are hassling them unmercifully.
when I'm there I do what I can, but I don't have enough
money to solve their problem.. They are only one family of
hundreds... Their poverty is not unique in the world, I
know. but I don't see the rest of the world. It's killing me
and I can't do anything about it.... the world is F###d up.
When I talk to Cubans here in Miami, rich Cubans, they are
only interested in revenge.... never a mention of
help...pisses me off.. No body is interested in
them...Castro seems bent on keeping them under thumb, total
control, even down to only having water twice a day. He has
managed to find a way to get hold of their illicit dollars,
with his dollar stores. The exiles are only interested in
their families. And by the insistence of the exiles in the
US, maintaining the embargo. Which is only affecting the
poor, without dollars. These families are being overlooked
and ignored.. It always amazes me how they can stay such
wonderful people.....I wish I could see a better future for
them.... but....but....but.... ?
Hey Pete, Your humanity is commendable, but Cuba is only a
small portion of world poverty. Besides, they are doing well
compare to African, Vietnamese, and rural Chinese. How many
other places you visit? And the Miami Cuban only want
revenge? How do you know? How many you survey? What do you
think the $2 million a day they sent to Cuba is for? They
had to endure the insult from Havana after they were
persecuted and exile. You expect love letters for Fidel?
To Che Jr:
I debate with you and didn't find you open minded. I simply
ask you not to believe nor disbelieve Forbe, but ask where
they get their conclusion on Castro. In finding out the
truth, let's look at facts; not pre-conceived prejudice.
your nemesis
Where is the evidence for the assertion that Castro is among
the 10th richest people in the world? If a magazine makes
such a bold and farfetched statement they should provide
some evidence.
With the little that Cuba produces where could Castro have
amassed such riches, even over 40 years? For a person to be
in the top ten of the world's richest he would have to be
fabulously rich. We are talking many billions of dollars. I
for one do not believe that Castro is robbing Cuba, but I
have no evidence to prove this. They have no evidence, or at
least, have not come up with it. I ask again, where is the
evidence?
Tony, I seem to have hit a raw nerve of yours. Sorry, You
wouldn't happen to be a Cuban, living in Miami, With a hate
of Castro, would you? Your attitude is exactly what I have
found among exiled Cubans, hating Castro to the point that
they will do anything for revenge. Just waiting the
opportunity. As for the two million dollars a day you
mention. I believe you, if you tell me. I have no way of
knowing. If you have details of how that money is being
distributed, I would be very interested to hear. I can tell
you for sure, It's not reaching the people in the street. I
know of money that is sent to private families. I have even
taken some myself for other people. I know of money that is
spent on subversive activities, aimed at the downfall of
Castro. But as to helping my family in Havana, I don't see
anything being done to help them. The bodegas are empty, but
the dollar stores are full. If, as you say there is $60
million a month pouring onto the streets of Havana, please
tell me how this one family can get just a few dollars of
it? It's not my intention to antagonize you, or any body
else. And of course, you're quite right the suffering
throughout the world is intolerable. I can't save the world,
but I am doing what I canà How about you?
Che Jr:
Unlike you in the other post, I like to get my facts
straight before I make my point. And that would be your task
to direct your inquiry to Forbe.
To give you an idea your logic don't stick, NOTHING in the
virtual reality exist,let alone produce; but the stock price
of Amazon, Yahoo, ect has gone up the roof. How you account
for that? You think the 40 yr is not enuf to be the 10th
richest? How many yrs did Bill Gates had to be #1?(And he
don't have the convience of being head of state!)
Point is: It only take luck, guild, and thirst of blood to
make it to the top. Once you make it, the difference betw $1
billion and $10 billion is meaningless.(I'll settle for .001
billion)When you can do what you want on to 11 million
people for 40 yr, does the ledger mean a thing?
Don't believe Forbe, but don't rule them out just because
you are Fidelista.
I was born in a different totaltarian state. I witness first
hand of hypocritcy from my family's suffering, I've grown
up hating all oppresion. When I graduated from high school,
I immediately join the US Marines to serve the country. They
turned out to be disappointment(no real combat mission). I
then went Army Rangers in hope of receiving a mission one
day to snuff a dictator. But the more I see things from an
insider point of view the more I realize Congress won't let
this happen. The useless europeans bitch about everything
American. The president is a wimp and a draft dodger. This
is a kinder, gentler world in the hands of peaceniks. So I
just retain my skills and concentrate on living well in NYC.
As for Cubans in Miami, don't like them as much as Cubans in
Cuba; but admire them for turning Miami from a shithole to
prosperous hub. These are folk Che Jr call worms and if
that's true, send more of them here, we could use hard
workers. The 2 mill sent is only a figure from gov source.
It's in the form of remittance from these 'worms' to family.
It afloat Fidel's worker's paradise in trickles. But it's
real, like it or not. YOU can estimate the amount by seeing
how many live in Miami, then ask any one how much is sent to
relatives each yr. The US gov of course keep better track,
but the figures shouldn't be too far off. Any $$ that reach
the island is $$ that reach the island. It'll have to be
spent or it's worthless papers. Even aim at Fidel's plunge,
long as it's on the island it will eventually benefit other
families. You were right dictators hit a note in me. But
what really antagonized me is the naive born under a free
sky who shed tears for oppressors(Che Jr, you listening??)
The sky and land I sworn to defend and am heavily tax for
it(my brother is still active military) I have no beef with
Castro and even believe 40 yr ago he might be a good man.
But I'll jump at the chance to wax an oppressor. This's what
Castro become, & his Asshole sympathisors are accomplice to
the misery.
As you, I'm doing my bit of what I can, probably the same
way. Check out "Yanks in Cuba", about 10 post down. You'll
like it as well as get a better insight betw me vs Assholes