ALT.MAGICK Frequently Asked Questions

               		          ( http://www.hollyfeld.org/amgkfaq )




To: alt.magick, alt.magick.ethics, alt.magick.folk, alt.magick.order, 
    alt.magick.sex, alt.magick.tantra, alt.magick.tyagi, alt.pagan.magick, 
    alt.answers and news.answers
Subject: alt.magick FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions)
Followup-To: alt.magick,alt.magick.tyagi
References: REF Master
Summary: This is the Hypertext Edition of the alt.magick FAQ.  The FAQ is 
	 intended as an introductory file and its content may be discussed
         within the alt.magick Usenet newsgroup.  The FAQ is available via FTP.
Reply-to: tyaginator (tyagi@houseofkaos.abyss.com)


Archive-name: magick/faq
Updated: 9612
Posting-frequency: monthly or by inquiry




                                   CONTENTS



	00 FOREWORD
	_______________________________________________________________

	10 NEWSGROUP
	11 Why do you spell (alt.)magick with a K?
	12 Shouldn't there be limits to what people can post here?
	_______________________________________________________________

	20 SUBJECT
	21 What is magic(k)?
	22 Is magick real, how does it work, what influences it?
	23 Is magick black/white?  Should we do black magick?
	24 Is magick compatible with modern Science?
	25 How are magick and religion/mysticism related or different?
	_______________________________________________________________

	30 STUDIES
	31 How should I start learning about magick?  teachers?
	32 What are the best books for a beginner to read?
	33 Where is online information about magick to be found?
	_______________________________________________________________

	40 SPELL COMPILATIONS
	41 Love/Lust
	42 Summoning Demons/Hexing/Cursing/Death
	_______________________________________________________________

	50 REFERENCES AND REFERRALS
	51 Archives
	52 Magick-Related Newsgroups
	53 Card Game Magic (e.g. 'The Obsession')
	54 Role-Playing Game Spellcasting
	_______________________________________________________________

	60 AFTERWORD
	61 Footnotes
	62 Credits
	63 Copyrights


   =======================================================================

00 FOREWORD

	The alt.magick FAQ may be obtained formatted in: 

		HTML    and    ASCII
	
	Check out the newsgroup REF files.


   =======================================================================

10 NEWSGROUP

	This section pertains to the most commonly asked questions about 
	the newsgroup itself; specifically the newsgroup's name and its 
	customs.

11 Why do you spell (alt.)magick with a K?

	alt.magick was created with a 'k' to avoid confusion with stage 
	magic. @01  

	'Magick' is a spelling popularly associated with Aleister Crowley, 
	yet the spelling precedes him by hundreds of years. @02

	Many people presume a difference between conjuring tricks and 
	occult spells; between magic and magick.  There may be grounds 
	for comparing them metaphorically to chemistry and alchemy.   

	Sr. Virakam and others maintain that it separated Crowley from 
	his competitors (and thus served as a marketing or elitist 
	scheme). @03

	Symonds and Grant contend that the 'k' is a conceit of 
	Crowley's and that it is related to potentially dangerous 
	("demonic and chaotic") energies, as well as life-oriented 
 	symbols such as 'khu' and 'kteis', for which they say it 
 	stands, "the complement to the wand (or phallus) which is 
 	used by the Magician in certain aspects of the Great Work." @04 

12 Shouldn't there be limits to what people can post here?

	There has been movement, off and on over the years, to work 
 	toward some sort of moderated alt.magick.* forum, but this
        has never been successfully carried out.

	There are many subgroups of alt.magick to which specific 
	types of discussion should be taken if you wish to cooperate 
	with newsgroup regulars.  Here are a few of the discussion-
	oriented newsgroups to get you started:

		alt.magick.ethics       (philosophia:ethics)
	        alt.magick.folk                 (primitivas)
		alt.magick.order                 (politicos)
	        alt.magick.tantra              (eros/tantra)
		alt.magick.tyagi                 (synthesia)

	There is a comprehensive list of posting suggestions in the 
	document called 'alt.magick RULES'. These are quotes from 
	Usenet authorities regarding posting content.

	In terms of limiting the *substance* or *topic*, some 
	copyrighted files have been under intense heat from occult 
	organizations to keep them from being posted to the newsgroup.  

	There is often a great outcry anytime someone posts a ritual 
	or suggestion which conflicts with the morality or maturity 
	level of participants, yet as alt.magick is not moderated, 
	complaints and savvy folks who know how to cancel posted 
	messages will be able to keep a single post from being seen, 
	discussion of it carrying over into one of the sub-forums 
	at most.

	In short, there are no technical limitations, but there are
	some factions (participants, occult groups) who have a very
	sincere interest in affecting what is posted.

    
   =======================================================================

20 SUBJECT

	There are a few questions about magic(k) which arise
	consistently.  These concern an analysis of magick, 
	its workings and principles, and its relationship to 
	science, religion and morality.

21 What is magic(k)?

	Magick has been defined by many people in many different 
	ways.  One infamous mage defined it as "the Science and Art 
	of causing Change to occur in conformity with Will." @05

	Some see magick as a kind of energy which pervades the cosmos.
	Others see it as a psychic tool by which we may influence the
	material world using symbols and ritual.  Many see it as a
	means of coming to unite with the divine, and some consider
	it to be the exercise of will or Will.
	
	Whatever the word means, 'magick' is the subject, generally, 
	of the newsgroup, and will likely be given many differing and 
	contradictory meanings during discussions there.  

22 Is magick real, how does it work, what influences it?

	Many have suggested the differentiation of magical 'currents' 
	or 'energies' based on style and/or intent.  Some posit the 
	notion of principles, a la scientific structure, 'laws of 
	magick' and whatnot.  Others approach it more subjectively,
	considering all knowledge about the elements of magick to be 
	personal and therefore particular only to the individual 
	condition, variable of form.

	All of these are popular responses to this question, though 
	more inventive theories would be welcomed.  Conventional 
	approaches may be cross-posted to sci.philosophy.meta.

23 Is magick black/white?  Should we do black magick?

        For discussion about the ethics of magick, see alt.magick.ethics.

24 Is magick compatible with modern Science?

	An oft-asked question, particularly with reference to 
	Heisenberg and chaos theory.  Hang around a little before 
	getting into one of these discussions.  They can take quite 
	a while to untangle.

25 How are magick and religion/mysticism related or different?

	There have been a number of different discussions on these 
	subjects.  The hypotheses I can remember are the 
	magick/individual:religion/group model, and the idea that 
	religion is the devolution of magick.  Some do not seem 
	to discern between magick and mysticism at all, and many 
	have never considered the subject, being unexposed 
	to the latter.

	Thelemites might equate magick with will and mysticism with 
	love, and the association has been made 'tween mysticism 
	and theurgy, magick and thaumaturgy.  

	For more on mysticism, see the Mysticism section of the 
	_Mage's Guide to the Internet_. 


	================================================================

30 STUDIES

	How to learn about magick and what ought be considered the 
	best sources are frequently discussed topics in the newsgroup.

	Occasionally someone will compile a REF file of newsgroup posts
	for a common topic.   Make a collection of posts and assist in the 
	project yourself by adding to them.

31 How should I start learning about magick?  teachers?

	As CHenningsson writes:

          "Books are one answer. There are actually books which 
           try to take you from your first tentative attempts 
           at relaxation into holding a ritual....  
	         
	  "Other than that....  Just do it!  If you like to, you 
           can see this as one of the very first exercises in Will; 
	   you Will yourself into making a ritual." 
	
	Some recommend the use of particular mechanisms or tools, 
	such as tarot, a magical diary, meditation or dreamwork.   
	Some recommend specific books or teachers, others place more 
	emphasis on the aptitude and imagination of the student.

	Robin provides marvelous advice:

          "Resist the temptation to believe what anyone else 
           tells you.  Try to invent ways to find out things 
           for yourself.  Remain skeptical.  

          "Look for ways in which you have may have been 
           doing magick without realizing it.  Think about 
           what it might mean if you could use it with 
           intention, and how you might go about that."

	MKampe offers: 

          "if you have clear notions of what magick is all 
           about, it might be better for you to pursue your 
           inner course and avoid outside contamination 
           [from teachers/books/etc.]."
 
	There are REF files on such things as the Kabbalistic Abyss,
	Chaos Magick, Wicca, and the Golden Dawn.  Teachers, masters 
	and adepts are often a topic of discussion in the newsgroup, 
	and magical organizations may wrangle out their political 
	issues in alt.magick.order.

	I would echo Lilith Darkchilde:

          "Take heed of those who say that they can teach 
           you all about what is magickal.  Especially if 
           you must join their 'coven' or group to do so.... 
          "I hold the key to my own self knowing."

32 What are some books for a beginner?

	There's are a few different booklists available.

33 Where is online information about magick to be found?

	Try the MaGI, especially the 'Occult' subsection.


	================================================================

40 SPELL COMPILATIONS

	Spells may be obtained from several offline sources, the folk 
	and ceremonial varieties maintained at times with diligent care.  

	The spells contained within the following sites may be dangerous 
	to your health.

41 Love/Lust

        I collected a file of spell responses in alt.magick.*
        over several years and placed them in a REF file.
        Other contributions would be welcomed.

42 Summoning Demons/Hexing/Cursing/Death

        Demon-summoning, curse- and death-oriented spells were
        collected from alt.magick.* over the last few years and
        these have been placed in a REF file (again, additional
        contributions welcome).  Also see the following newsgroup:

		alt.paranormal.spells.hexes.magic


	================================================================

50 REFERENCES AND REFERRALS

	After consulting the various resources listed in this FAQ
	and lurking in the newsgroup for a few weeks, feel free to 
	bring up any relevant subjects there.

51 Archives

	There are Usenet Archives within the Hollyfeld Internet site.

52 Magick-Related Newsgroups

	See the MaGI for much occult-related information.  
	Valuable Usenet alternatives include:

	(occult-related)
	alt.astrology
	 Ref: FAQ 
	alt.astrology.asian
	alt.chinese.fengshui
	 Ref: FAQ
	alt.divination
	alt.lucky.w
	alt.magick.chaos
	 Ref: FAQ
	alt.occult.kabbalah.golden-dawn
	alt.pagan.magick
	alt.tarot
	 Ref: (Tarot FAQ)
	 Ref: Layouts (REF)
	alt.virtual-adepts

	(darkness and power)
	alt.evil
	alt.horror.cthulhu
	alt.necronomicon
	alt.satanism
	talk.philosophy.humanism
	talk.philosophy.objectivism

	(eastern and mystical things)
	alt.consciousness.4th-way
	alt.consciousness.mysticism
	alt.fan.rumi
	alt.hindu
	alt.islam.sufi
	alt.meditation
	 Ref: Meditation FAQ
	alt.meditation.moderated
	alt.meditation.quanyin
	alt.meditation.shabda
	alt.meditation.transcendental
	alt.philosophy.taoism
	alt.philosophy.zen
	alt.sufi
	alt.yoga
	alt.zen
	alt.zen+budo
	soc.religion.eastern
	soc.religion.gnosis
	soc.religion.hindu
	soc.religion.islam
	soc.religion.quaker
	soc.religion.sikhism
	soc.religion.unitarian-univ
	soc.religion.vaishnava

        (psychology and consciousness) 
	alt.consciousness
	alt.drugs
	alt.drugs.chemistry
	alt.drugs.leri
	alt.drugs.pot
	alt.drugs.psychedelics
	alt.psychoactives
	alt.psychology.jung
	alt.psychology.mistake-theory
	alt.psychology.nlp
	alt.psychology.personality
	alt.psychology.synchronicity
	alt.psychology.transpersonal
	rec.drugs.psychedelic
	sci.psychology
	sci.psychology.consciousness
	sci.psychology.digest
	sci.psychology.misc
	sci.psychology.personality
	sci.psychology.psychotherapy
	sci.psychology.research
	sci.psychology.theory

        (shamanism/neopaganism/witchcraft)
	alt.folklore
	alt.folklore.gemstones
	alt.folklore.herbs
	alt.legends.king-arthur
	alt.mythology
	alt.mythology.mythic-animals
	alt.native
	alt.pagan
	alt.religion.asatru
 	alt.religion.orisha
	alt.religion.shamanism
	alt.religion.wicca
	alt.shamanism
	alt.techno-shamanism
	soc.religion.paganism
	soc.religion.shamanism

	(ufos/parapsychology/spiritualism)
	alt.consciousness
	alt.consciousness.near-death-exp
	alt.folklore.ghost-stories
	alt.folklore.suburban
	alt.hypnosis
	alt.mindcontrol
	alt.out-of-body
	alt.paranet
	alt.paranet.abduct
	alt.paranet.metaphysics
	alt.paranet.paranormal
	alt.paranet.psi
	alt.paranet.skeptic
	alt.paranet.ufo
	alt.paranormal
	alt.prophecies.nostradamus
	alt.psychology.transpersonal
	alt.skeptic
	alt.soulmates
	talk.religion.newage

53 Card Game Magic (e.g. 'The Obsession')

        There are many newsgroups in the rec.games.trading-cards
        hierarchy from which to choose.  Also see MOXPERL.

54 Role-Playing Game Spellcasting

        If you are looking for role-playing game magic, you can find
        it in the Great Net Spellbook.


	================================================================

60 AFTERWORD

	Thanks to all the fine authors of files I came across during my
	sift for networking documents to fill out this edition of the FAQ.
	May it remain unblemished by violence or imprisonment.  

61 Footnotes

	@01  -  See alt.magic (stage magic).

	@02  -  Due to his many publications and the orders
		he crafted, Aleister Crowley is revered by many and 
		despised by as many more, and his magical treatise 
		(_Book Four_, recently reissued assembled by Samuel 
		Weiser) may likely prove his most popular text.

	@03  -  "Aleister Crowley (if Soror Virakam may be relied upon) 
                is said to have adopted "the old spelling of MAGICK...
                in order to distinguish the Science of the Magi from 
      	        all its counterfeits." 
	              (_Magick_, eds. Symonds/Grant, p. 45 note).

	@04  -  _Magick_ eds. Symonds/Grant, p. xvi.

	@05  -  Magick in Theory and Practice, by Aleister Crowley; p. 7.

62 Credits

	Those that assisted in reviewing the FAQ whose ideas and/or 
	networking were utilized in the construction:

	                    ashton@netcom.com (AShub)
	        oispeggy@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu (Peggy Brown)
			    burkard@kodak.com (Kim Burkard)
                               dshoem@aol.com (Dshoem)
		kdavidso@library.uwaterloo.ca (Karen)
                         kim@newton.apple.com (peter kim)
			  robin@winternet.com (robin)
			   yronwode@sonic.net (catherine yronwode)

	If you have suggestions for changes or additions to document, 
	send them to the Editor (tyagi@houseofkaos.abyss.com).

	Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem.    -W. Occam

63 Copyrights

	This document is Copyright (c) 1996, tyagi nagasiva.

	All rights reserved.  Permission to distribute the collection 
	is hereby granted providing that distribution is electronic, 
	no money is involved, reasonable attempts are made to use the 
	latest version and all credits and this copyright notice are 
	maintained.  Other requests for distribution should be directed 
	to the Editor or to the individual authors of the quoted materials.

=============================================================================

	tyagi@houseofkaos.abyss.com (tyaginator)
	     Editor, alt.magick FAQ

FIN 9612